With her short film Black Dreams, multidisciplinary artist and emerging filmmaker Chiemeka Offor offers us a glimpse into the kaleidoscopic mind of young Black artists in New York City. A student at New York University, Offor depicts a dynamic dreamscape, replete with illusory imagery and narrations by herself and members of her community. The experimental visual poem and documentary explores themes of communion, love, belonging, and, of course, dreams through a girl’s talk with God. 

What do you want to be when you grow up? In Damien Hauser’s After the Long Rains (Baada Ya Masika in Swahili), Aisha sees a future of endless possibilities for herself when a school assignment prompts her to answer this age-old question. She resolves to use fishing as a vehicle to realize her aspirations of making it as an actress despite notions that fishing is a profession strictly for men. Under the tutelage of Hassan, her wayward fishing instructor, she chases her dreams while transcending cultural expectations.

In this conversation, I speak with Hauser, who at just 23 years old is a well-versed filmmaker with three feature films under his belt and Offor (21) who premiered her directorial debut at the New York Film African Festival while pursuing her undergraduate degree. The two young visionaries speak about the role of imagination in their processes, what inspires them, and how they’re finding being blossoming filmmakers in a field of veterans.

Cassell: In both of your films, young women and girls are shown challenging conventions in their communities. Why did you center young Black female protagonists as opposed to any other demographic? What has been the impact of bolstering those voices? 

Offor: I remember answering something similar during the [post-screening] panel, but that’s who I am, and I’m a part of that. And it feels most authentic to tell a story that I am closest to and to bring light to people that I’m closest to. I’m involved in the film and people that I care so much about and we have such similar experiences. Just talking about myself feels like breathing, it just comes so naturally to me. And so people like me are the stories I like to tell. It felt most immediate to me at this time of my life [to center Black women], because that is my community. But also, I want younger Black girls to see young Black women on screen or people close to their age that they can look up to because sometimes these inspirations feel super far-fetched and out of reach when we’re watching these films. But I think my favorite thing, especially about making documentaries, is that these are real-life people who look like your older sisters. They look like people you pass by on the street and are just very much themselves, but also very amazing. I have so many stories to tell and draw inspiration from them. I looked for a lot of those images when I was younger, and so I want to be a part of creating that for Black women–specifically for young Black women–because that time in your life is just… You’re always looking for something to tell you who you are, and so to send a good message instead of a bad one is what I’m trying to do. 

Hauser: Can I say, I really loved your film? And I really liked how, since it’s a documentary, it’s very real. But then this mix of things, those very poetic images and how you created this golden world was very nice. 

Offor: I was also going to say right when we got this call, because I just watched After the Long Rains last night, and I was like, ‘Oh, my God.’ It was insane. And you kind of got me. I know this is not about that so we can talk and I can share more of my thoughts, but it got me, because at first I was like, this is a little surreal, but it’s still based in reality. And then it just kept on going and going. And then the ending. Wow. Wow. 

Hauser: Thank you very much. Thank you. 

Offor: I love it. And to realize that you shot it, because I was like, ‘Who is the cinematographer?’ Because the way that light is happening, and just there’s this gleam. The whole film is glimmering at all moments. And I was like, ‘Wow, I wonder who the cinematographer was.’ And to realize that you were directing and also shooting the film was just amazing. I have a lot of other thoughts, but the whole call would be about that, instead. 

[Damien laughs.]

Hauser: I think it wasn’t a decision I made, but I always get inspired by my surroundings or thoughts I have. When I shot my first feature film, I went to Kenya for half a year and I lived with my grandmother. A very good friend was actually a twelve-year-old girl. While I was shooting, she always asked if I could teach her how to play the drums in church. But then I never was able to; I never had time. And then after shooting, I showed her how to play the drums and stuff. She was very inspiring, especially because I grew up in Switzerland, and what I found so crazy about not only her but all the children in Kenya, is how responsible they are, or they have to be, from a very young age because she helped her mother so, so much. I grew up in Switzerland, and here it’s the other way around. Of course, parents are responsible for their children. I mean, in Kenya, too. But then here [in Switzerland] the children in comparison are not as responsible at such a young age as they are in Kenya. And maybe people could view that as a good or a bad thing, but I thought it was a very beautiful thing. Depending on the circumstances, of course, there is also a big pressure on them sometimes. But yes, I started writing this story. And when writing a story about a little girl in Kenya with big dreams, all those themes, they automatically come into the script. It just happens organically. Especially there, where I was in Kenya, I lived very deep in the village. There, everything is much more traditional. So that’s why I know more about traditional Kenya than modern Kenya, like Nairobi. 

Cassell: Both of your films are beautiful, and I want to talk about that. But something that you’ve already touched on, is dreaming. What role do dreaming and imagination have in your process? And how do you mitigate that with the technical or pragmatic elements? 

Offor: This is so interesting because I’m taking an experimental screenwriting class right now, and we have to journal every day. A lot of us talk about our dreams every day, and we wake up and write our dreams. What attracted me to making this story in the first place? I knew it wanted to be a documentary about young Black women artists, of course, but also the connection between being an artist and being a dreamer…Just having dreams and drawing inspiration from those dreams. Being an artist and saying that out loud and pursuing it is a dream in itself and takes a lot of delusion and audacity. That was a big part of meshing the two for my project. I don’t know if you guys have this experience, but sometimes my dreams become memories if I don’t take a moment to differentiate them [from reality]. Especially if it feels so real and it’s about something that’s in my life a lot, then I will have to make a conscious effort to separate the two, or else it mixes. So I’m kind of like an unreliable narrator in my own life. Dreams tell us so much about real life anyway, so it’s okay that they mix. A lot of my stories come from my imagination. But that’s a good question. Technically, it’s done with color and light and pushing things to the extreme where I see these moments in real life, but they’re kind of like…

Cassell: Almost like fantasia. 

Offor: I guess so, yeah. It’s all based on reality. But then when I’m crafting a story visually at least, I’m like, ‘Why not? Why wouldn’t I, because I’m also a painter, make the color more saturated?’ or ‘Why wouldn’t I make it what I see in my head and mix it with reality in some way?’ Or make the lighting super fantastical or play with the shadows? I don’t know. Because we have those surreal moments in real life, too. And I think that’s where the inspiration comes from. 

Hauser: Well, I’ve made movies for a very long time, since I was seven. I never had a break from making movies so it became a part of my life. Work and life are almost like the same thing for me. When I imagine something that. When I have a movie idea or something, the process always looks the same. I think about stuff or I get influenced by my surroundings, and then I’m always thinking. My brain is always looking at the world or other people. And so I’m constantly inspired but I never really have a very strong vision when it comes to things. I never want something to look exactly this way or that way. But very often when I’m shooting, I don’t prepare a lot, even with After the Long Rains. I went to Kenya and then we prepared for two weeks. I found the crew and cast the actors in two weeks and then we started shooting. But I didn’t have the locations and stuff. I just look around and I look at what I have, and then I work with what I have. And very often when you’re not too attached to your vision, but you just look around at what you have, you’ll find many beautiful things. And even maybe from the outside, it would look like the theme of the film was already written into the script but it wasn’t. I actually went there and it was rainy season. And then I was like, ‘Oh, okay, maybe I’ll have to write it into the script,’ because when I thought about the movie, I always envisioned sunny weather, and I still tried to maintain those clouds and the blue sky, but I had to write the rain in. And then I changed my script. So my vision, my ideas, the imagination aspect are always constantly changing and I’m never too attached to the dreams or how I envisioned them. Maybe I confused vision and dream.

Cassell: I think that those are two complementary parts of the process. But in addition to your films’ narratives, they’re both very aesthetically compelling. How do the aesthetics of your films help further the story you are trying to tell? And as a filmmaker, what role do aesthetics and cinematography play in your storytelling overall? 

Hauser: I have a thing with memories. I’m a very forgettable person, but I love to talk to people about their experiences. I love feeling nostalgic or looking back at a time in my life. And I always like this viewpoint because when you look back, you see things more clearly. Maybe you’re less attached to it emotionally, but you still can see things very clearly. This movie is from the perspective of Aisha looking back ten years ago. The goal of the film was to show how she sees her memories of that time. When I look back at my childhood, I look at a very saturated and colorful world. And so I tried to show this world through her eyes and also visually, to make it very colorful so that you want to be in this world because very often I long to be in my memories.

Cassell: That’s beautiful. That’s really insightful. 

Offor: What Damien just said, he longs for his memories or, he longs to recreate or live in his memories–when I think of the world visually, I prefer thinking of my dreams or memories too because as I mentioned, I’m a painter and a visual artist. I used a lot of different mediums before I got into film. Even with photography, it was like I was trying to capture the world or moments at their best or their most beautiful. So finding those surreal moments, like I mentioned, especially in beautiful places like Nigeria or at beautiful times or these portals in real life, whether it’s through the sun or moments in nature, and trying to hold that image still. So I think with film, I look for those beautiful moments. I look for people. I also feel like Black people are very poetic, African people are very poetic in who they are and how they look. And so it would be a disservice to not build a world around them that reflects them and their beings. The most complimentary world looks super colorful and is very intentional about how they’re lit, what colors bring out who they are and their skin tones the best. That environment starts from the subject that I’m capturing. I just think Black people are so beautiful; it’s hard to not make the world around them beautiful. I’m always thinking about aesthetics and colors. Because I’m a painter, I love color theory. And so I just love things that complement each other. And I love always having that in the back of my head so much that sometimes it happens now without me thinking about it too much. As I mentioned earlier, there are moments in everyday life when you meet that beauty [of a dream] for the first time to even be able to think it up again or have a memory of it enhanced in some other way. And so I look for those moments, and then I just kind of drag them out like a dream would. 

Cassell: I want to talk about this year’s theme, Convergence of Time. Film and art in general depict moments in time and can be like time capsules. What do you want future generations to understand about the times that you’re depicting in your film? 

Hauser: Not only future generations but also the generations now. I think that the world is not black and white, but that it’s very colorful. I believe this theme is in all of my movies. If you look at After the Long Rains, I think the very first version of the script was much more from Aisha’s side, and the mother had no voice. But at some point, I figured out the mother’s opinion was equally as important as Aisha’s opinion. 

Offor: What do I want future generations to see in this film? Well, I hope that the issues talked about aren’t as prevalent. I hope that there are more spaces for the representation of Black women artists. I hope that they look back on this and they’re like, ‘Oh, this is a beautiful thing, but I don’t feel it as much,’ almost like a ‘thank you’ for the generations before that had to constantly be intentional about making space. I hope it’s part of a collection because there are so many other works that are doing the same thing as my film. It’s just my perspective on it. And so I hope it just gets to live in a collection of moments. This film holds a lot of longing–everybody in this film is looking for something. I hope that whatever that is that we’re all searching for is found. Which is kind of a lot of pressure. But then again this film is not alone in what it’s saying and what it’s doing. I just hope it inspires other people to also look at the people around them and look at who they love and think about what that means because the questions that I ask are like, ‘What does it mean to be free?’ and ‘What does it mean to feel love?’ And not only amongst Black women artists or Black women in general but whoever is looking within and around them and lookin to see themselves and the people around them. I want that to be the impact. And ultimately just love. The world is very dark. If as an artist, I’m able to help bring some light or some moments of peace or reflection…Ultimately love is the main thing that I’m trying to bring to the work that I make. So I hope they feel that, too. 

Cassell: One of the things that your film did for me was it made me look around and take note of this moment because as young artists, as emerging artists, these are the early stages. In a decade or two, we will be in different positions and I think it’s great that your film serves as a document that captures those initial stages of your trajectory. And the same with your film, Damien. So with that being said, what role has mentorship taken in your work? How have intergenerational relationships impacted your work?

Offor: I have a mentor, Billy Gerard Frank, who helped me with this project and inspired how much water I used in Black Dreams. He was an old professor of mine, and then I ended up being his studio assistant. That’s somebody I have to mention when thinking about mentorship, especially on this project. The second part of your question made me think of ancestors, and I’m not sure why. I’m always thinking about the people who came before me, especially when I look at myself or make portraits of people in my family and see what makes my face and the faces of the people I’m around. And my friend who’s an artist too (and sounds like a prophet) was like, ‘We carry before us on our backs every day when we get up.’ In the film, I’m talking to my mom, but I’m also talking to my future self. That God figure stands as so many people in one. I mentioned that I want to tell stories about people my age and the people who are around me right now, but I feel like a lot of who I am is where I come from, who has raised me, and who has shown me how to be a woman, a human being, an artist, and a maker. I think a big reason why I’m an artist is because my grandma is such a good cook. Those connect. She taught me how to cook and I feel like cooking is very similar to making art with how present you have to be in it, how much you have to care; how you can add and knowing that you can’t take away too much. I come from a long line of matriarchs, and so I’m always thinking about them when I’m thinking about [the present], even though they might not always be around me or may have passed. My friend’s quote sticks with me because everything you do in the present is somehow connected to your past. So I honor that with my work and explore that by finding ways to connect back to where I’m from through whatever I make or whatever story I’m telling. 

Hauser: It’s a complicated question, but when it comes to filmmaking, I am inspired by so many people and it’s always very small things. It’s not only by filmmakers or artists–it’s friends or moments with other people. My father helped me to become who I am right now. Because there’s a certain time in your life, where your parents, they’re there and they’re parenting you. Then at some point, it’s only you; you have to learn from your own mistakes. You have to teach yourself many things and you can only learn by experiencing things. Those experiences mentor you in a sense as other people mentor you. 

Cassell: What insight does being a young filmmaker offer you when it comes to creating art through film? Are there any instances where you find your experiences as a young person to be advantageous in a field whose professionals are typically much older? 

Offor: When you said that, it reminded me of the fact that I’m still a very new filmmaker and have not made that many projects yet. Technicality is important so I don’t want to discredit it, but coming in with an idea or kind of not knowing too much and then figuring it out allows me to do it my own way without thinking too much or sticking to how it should be done. Approaching it as a visual artist has been fun because it seems like I’m a little more open to [the work] taking shape in a different way than how my peers who have been film majors in undergrad are. I think more about being an artist and the story or the feeling than how this fits into the world of other films or Film with the capital ‘F’ and what it’s supposed to be. I am still really excited to keep learning, but I’m glad that I know that I’m always grounded in what I want as an artist. And that doesn’t always make sense, but it’s why my work is very experimental. I’m excited to see how that blends more with my technical experience and how much more I get to learn about film, filmmaking, and [film] history. I’m eager to be more intentional, and I know that will come with years of experience. And so I’m excited to be a seasoned filmmaker, too. 

Hauser: I see a lot of things being very advantageous. It is an industry that many old people work in because, in the past, you needed a lot of money to do a movie, but nowadays you don’t. Nowadays, everybody has a camera and everybody can make films. And the beauty of that is that suddenly it’s not only the 1% that is telling the same stories, but suddenly the whole world can tell stories. We live in an era in which many young filmmakers are coming out of many different regions–mostly indie filmmakers–but with many unique stories. Film hasn’t existed for a very long time, so it’s still new and there is still a lot to explore–that’s why I’m hyped! I feel very free because I’m able to shoot movies very, very low budget. It’s nice because it gives me full creative freedom and the freedom to experiment and try things out. In my first two features, I experimented and I broke the rules a lot. I realized afterward, why those rules exist. It’s funny–when I wrote the script for After the Long Rains, I tried following the rules a little bit more when it came to story structure while still maintaining my style, [so as] not to feel like I’m in a cage. I did another movie that I’m still editing and with this one, I completely tried to break the rules again. It’s nice because when movies are expensive, you suddenly have a responsibility to make the money back. It is a must otherwise, you can’t work in the industry anymore. But nowadays you can make movies cheaply, so you can try things that are not that commercial. And maybe you find new stories or things that are beautiful but were never made because people always had that pressure. 

Cassell: I like the emphasis on the accessibility of film these days. I learned that you did your own cinematography and that is definitely a cut in the budget. So I think it also opens up a lot of people who are apprehensive to embark on these types of projects because they think it’s inaccessible and therefore not possible for them to bring their stories to life. As we’re wrapping up, New York is an international city filled with people from all walks of life and both of you attended the 31st New York African Film Festival. How did premiering your film at NYAFF broaden the conversations that your work set out to spark? 

Hauser: When you show a film to an audience and you see the reactions, you don’t have a conversation fully with all of them. But then after the screening (and I went to both screenings), people came up to me and then we talked one-on-one. And those conversations are always the best because there are so many different perspectives and people who are so emotionally attached to the story, which is always so crazy. I thought it was so beautiful that it was shown, especially at this festival, because the audience was the right audience. It was an audience that understood the story, and that’s why it was very nice and it was very beautiful to have those one-on-one conversations after the screening. 

Offor: Especially with this being my directorial debut, the African Film Festival is the perfect place to have it because, as Damien said, the audience knows the [themes] so well already because that’s just who they are. There were just so many different people. I’m thinking about Rehanna [Ngom] who came for the Festival and came with her parents, directly from Senegal. There were African American people there. There were people who weren’t African and were from other cultures. There were people who were local to New York and people who made the film with me that were able to be there, too. It was just such a treat to have so many different perspectives there. [The Lincoln Center] closed right after my screening. They rushed us out because it was closing but I’m glad that people who did want to talk to me still came up to me and reached out in other ways, too. The Festival at its core is just such a multicultural, multi-layered space. It was amazing.

Cassell: And finally, perhaps the simplest question, what is next from both of you and where can we keep up with your upcoming projects? Because now we’re invested! 

Offor: I am entering my final year of undergrad at NYU, and so I’m going to be working on my thesis, which is an experimental short. I’m editing another documentary right now about Black women’s mental health and how it connects to hair salons and the role of the hairstylist within that world of how we look which is so connected to how we feel. I’m also still painting and working on photo projects that connect to these documentaries or the people I documented. Where can I be found? I have Instagram, and my website and email, too, if anybody ever wants to collaborate or has any questions. I love talking. I love conversations like this so much. This is my favorite thing to talk about: dreams and the African diaspora, yay! So I’m also open to that, too. 

Cassell: Damien, what about you? What are you working on? You hinted at having a project going right now. And where can we keep up with you to see upcoming projects? 

Hauser: I don’t know where we can see the upcoming projects, but I’m still editing. It’s also a feature film, I shot it last December and January. I shot it at the same place I shot After the Long Rains, with almost the same people. It’s called Memory of Princess Moody. You will not recognize the place because it takes place in the future. It’s a future where kingdoms return and they abandon modern technologies. It’s from the perspective of a filmmaker who recorded a lot of footage of his life. We see the footage and he’s talking about what happened in his life. It’s a mockumentary, like a fake documentary. What I found so interesting is I recorded many things, like all my surroundings, I recorded them constantly. And I never recorded people while they were fighting or something, but I always recorded them when we had a beautiful moment with each other. Even my family, I’m never recording my mother when I’m fighting with her [so] when I look at the footage, I only see beautiful moments. And in films, it’s always like, it’s always like what’s the conflict in this film? Usually, in film, there is always a second act, which is conflict-based. You still have conflict through his voiceovers or through what he’s saying, but then it only contains beautiful moments mostly. 
To stay up-to-date on Damien Hauser’s professional projects, you can go to his website or follow him on Instagram.